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Justify

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lightng99 View Drop Down
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  Quote lightng99 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Sep 2019 at 5:59pm
anti-racing brought this on ,same ones who say greyhounds are forced to run and mistreated ,they will not stop till they win ,the whole time they are riding horses in polo matches .
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  Quote trooper7 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Sep 2019 at 6:02pm
Thank you beisbol.

The finest statement on the whole subject. Except for the pun; thoroughly unjustified.

Edited by trooper7 - 13 Sep 2019 at 6:03pm
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  Quote supertaffy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Sep 2019 at 7:13pm
It's interesting to note that while it was 300 nanograms in the urine the blood tests were lower.

They make a good argument for it being contamination as it was found in combination with atropine which wouldn't show up if the drug was administered on its own but does when jimson weed is the cause.

https://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/daily/download/2019-09-13
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  Quote trooper7 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Sep 2019 at 8:33pm
It's amazing what we learn by our intrepid contributors. I, for one, cannot tell who's most complicit; the industry, regulators or benefactors {ads/tv/sponsors}.

Without a doubt, I feel sketchy happens at every track. Even during major races trainers, are always looking for an edge.

That Baffort is guilty of something is not for me to say. Neither do I condemn the halo dollars involved in this industry, though they are heavily invested.

Cynical opinion to be sure, it's all about $$$ - No matter how small a track or how national one it is. Within this group, their better good will prevail. Real life.

Justify's record is excellent and you'd be hard-pressed to find any fault. He was so much the better than his opponents.



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  Quote waremblem5 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2019 at 12:49am
Originally posted by trooper7


This is a vacuous statement. Unbelievably juvenile. This would be an interesting debate if the issue hadn't degraded into a 3rd grade playground hissy fit.


To recap:

1. My original statement on this matter holds true. I said the story was biased and BS. Multiple industry sources confirm this.

2. I haven't made a single personal attack in this thread. I've ignored baiting comments. This is not an "all parties are guilty" scenario. Where there has been fake news presented, I have called it out.

3. If you don't want to believe an upstanding trainer with 40 years of experience, along with prominent members of the industry you claim to enjoy, then I can't help you. You are free to believe what you want to believe, but I am thoroughly convinced this was feed contamination and I see no wrongdoing on the CHRB part. I believe Bob Baffert. The CHRB made a choice. Important people make those every day. Not everything needs to be transparent on your twitter feed to allow you to weight in.
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iant View Drop Down
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  Quote iant Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2019 at 5:00am
The brutal reality is the issue now everything is in the open (I doubt that is totally true) is simple.

The CHRB are totally incompetent and need to be sacked if they do not resign.

If a proper enquiry was undertaken the facts with additional testing could have proven it was contamination. This requires testing of all horses in barns with positive race day tests.

It is done elsewhere in the world. Even the lame BHA look exceptional compare to these clowns.

The result would have been given Justify would have been disqualified from the race as per the rules. Then they could have announced that due to the likelihood of contamination they were reducing the sanctions going forward.

The obvious question is why use a product that can be easily contaminated when there are perfectly usable substitute products available. That is poor management. Wood shavings are commonly used in "Sport horse" bedding for these obvious reasons.

The out shot is Justify would be marketed as an unbeaten "on the track" triple crown winner. Three extra words but no tarnish on him.

It reduces external factions having a go at horse racing in an easy win.

My favourite quote was the lady from PETA saying Justify is a sex slave. That made me laugh especially given a certain person users name and what he did not do as a stallion. Spent his night time playing dungeons and dragons. The daytimes failing to fight the forces of gravity.
   
   
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  Quote nextbonus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2019 at 8:30am




Edited by nextbonus - 14 Sep 2019 at 9:26am
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  Quote flagdown Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2019 at 8:55am
Originally posted by dixiedotco

6 other horses in 4 different barns also came back with a positive scopolamine test, FWIW.


Dixie - were any of the other horses in Bob's barn and if so, were any of the concentrations as high as Justify's? I know he's a voracious eater, so I would expect them to be a higher if contamination.

I find it improbable that Justify was good enough to win the TC while testing clean, but the connections were so unsure of the abilities that they would dope the horse to make sure he got there.

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  Quote jwsonny Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2019 at 10:15am
Originally posted by beisbol

Here's some more "pseudo-science" from the American Academy of Clinical Chemistry.

http://www.aacc.org/community/divisions/tdm-and-toxicology/toxin-library/jimson-weed

Like anything in life, it seems we'll need a lot more information to make a reasonable conclusion. Contamination seems the most likely cause here, but that's not the point.

Just because the general public is ignorant about the finer points of horse racing and clinical science, a cover-up (even if no crime is committed) is neither beneficial nor justifiable.

Pun slightly intended.

The fact that Walden is on Twitter hashtagging 'fakenews' tells me all I need to know about motivations. The Drape story was trash, but that does not mean exoneration of the CHRB or accountability for Baffert.





Perfectly stated.
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  Quote tyedye Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2019 at 10:41am
Originally posted by waremblem5

Originally posted by trooper7


This is a vacuous statement. Unbelievably juvenile. This would be an interesting debate if the issue hadn't degraded into a 3rd grade playground hissy fit.


To recap:

3. If you don't want to believe an upstanding trainer with 40 years of experience, along with prominent members of the industry you claim to enjoy, then I can't help you. You are free to believe what you want to believe, but I am thoroughly convinced this was feed contamination and I see no wrongdoing on the CHRB part. I believe Bob Baffert. The CHRB made a choice. Important people make those every day. Not everything needs to be transparent on your twitter feed to allow you to weight in.


The exact same line of thinking that allowed Jerry Sandusky to run rampant as well as the catholic church. It must be impossible for "good" people to ever do wrong things.

You can't even admit the CHRB handled this in an unbelievably poor manner. Any reasonable person will at least come to THAT conclusion. You keep going into defensive mode as if CHRB and Baffert are the victims here. They are not. An investigation will flush all the facts needed. What the hell is so wrong with a proper investigation? All level-headed folks here seem to agree that they'd like to know more information into the whole situation since there are clear irregularities. Put your response is "SHUT UP, CHRB ARE GOOD AND FINE AND DO TOUGH THINGS" --- brilliant rebuttal. Jeffrey Skilling and Enron would have hired you on the spot.    

Pro tip: When it comes to govt/public entities it is extremely, extremely important to even avoid the image of impropriety, much less the impropriety itself. As a contractor this is something that is beaten into our head every year during compliance training. If it may be even a potential conflict of interest, report it. May look even slightly askew? Don't do it...report it to legal.
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